Dear Torrid...

There’s a really great thread going on at the Fatshionista community on LiveJournal where members are telling Torrid what they like, hate, need and want from the store. There are some common threads emerging and it’s a fascinating read.

In that vein, here is my open letter to Torrid. This is going to be lengthy but hopefully it gets my ideas across.

Dearest Torrid,

I like your spirit. I like that you’re filling a niche that few have been willing to fill. I like that you’ve realized that young, plus size women want to have access to the same types of clothing as their straight-sized counterparts.

I like that you’ve continued to grow, despite claims that offering young women the option of buying clothes in plus sizes encourages an “unhealthy lifestyle.” I like that shopping in your stores is fun and relaxed. It’s so different from what I went through ten or fifteen years ago as a plus sized girl with very few options.

Having said all that, there is room for improvement and I hope you’re open to honest opinions. We wouldn’t take the time to share them if we didn’t believe that you had the potential to be a great store that fills a need that millions of women share.

Price and quality
Prices have gone up and quality has gone down, way down. I know from tracking sales through my blog that most people who shop through my links only do so when there’s a 50% off clearance sale. I don’t know if that is true overall for your entire customer base but if a good deal of customers are only willing to shop with you when the items are as cheap as they’re going to get, that tells you how much they think those items are worth.

I don’t believe the solution is to either lower prices OR increase quality. I believe you should do both. Do some market research, look at sales trends, do whatever it is that retailers do but figure out the true value of what you’re offering versus what you’re customers are willing to spend. The current price points don’t match the quality of your clothing, shoes and accessories.

Young consumers may not understand the concept of cost per wear or how to determine if an item is decent quality before purchasing it. However, these young consumers know the value of their hard-earned money and if an item that they invested in falls apart after one wash, they won’t come back for more.

If you’re aligning yourself with stores like H&M and Forever 21, then the pricing needs to match the quality of what you’re offering. If you are indeed looking to fill a niche for inexpensive, trendy, one season items, then make those items affordable. Don’t sell a $15 dress for $60 and expect people to believe it’s worth the money.

Sizing
Sizing and quality go hand in hand. When you buy from a line or brand that invests in quality, you can be sure that sizing will be consistent across the entire line. Inconsistent sizing shows that you haven’t taken the time for quality assurance.

I understand that manufacturing a huge amount of product is expensive and quality assurance costs money. If you’re unable to standardize sizing across all of your items then you need to offer individual size charts for each item on your website.

It might also be beneficial to look at expanding your sizes, not down to a size 10/12 but UP to a size 30/32. I can promise you there is a market for these sizes and the women who wear those sizes will happily give your store a chance if you cater to their needs. Just make sure the proportions are properly scaled to each size and not just made bigger as you go up the size chart. Respect the needs of every one of your customers and they’ll come back time and again.

Trendy vs. Classic
There’s one area that Lane Bryant really excels in and it’d be a good idea for you to consider it – they have a core line of essential items (like jeans, basic tees, button up shirts, career wardrobe staples, etc.) and a line of trendier, seasonal items. There is a way to offer both.

It seems like Torrid has tried to do this in the past but have turned to focusing more on the trendy stuff. Trendy is fine, I love it. But you really need a good quality, core line of basics that people will come to rely on.

I’ve bought the more basic pieces from Torrid in the past but if the quality isn’t there (see above) then I don’t come to rely on those pieces and don’t feel the need to buy more. You need items that hook people onto your brand so they come in for that item (like jeans) but end up buying trendier pieces to wear with it (like a t-shirt or fun jacket).

I’m not expecting Torrid to be in front of trends and be fashion forward. I’m really not. I’m glad that you offer the ridiculously over the top trendy pieces that younger shoppers like. But let’s be real for a moment - how many plus size teens are going to ever wear a tube dress or lamé leggings?

That isn’t to say I don’t think there’s a place for tube dresses and lamé leggings. I’m saying that there needs to be a balance. A lot of women need professional items that are still young, fresh and creative. There are people who can wear “club clothes” all day every day but not many. Are you selling to your real customers, or the people your real customers wish they were?

Am I too old for Torrid?
I’m 29 years old. I’ve been shopping at Torrid since its inception in 2001 when I was 21. Obviously, the clothes I’m drawn to now are different from what I was wearing then. However, I feel like I’m way too old to even think about wearing some of the things I’m seeing on the Torrid website. I can never tell if the clothes are as crazy as I think they are or if I’m just becoming a total square.

I can tell you that I have several pieces from Torrid that I bought just 2 – 3 years ago that I still like and aren’t over the top trendy. I really feel like there’s a way to draw in teens who really want to wear acid wash denim (shudder) and not so trendy shoppers who just want cute pieces that can be mixed in with the rest of their wardrobe.

I feel like I’m being aged out of Torrid’s customer base and damn it, I’m not old!

Some other miscellaneous points I want to cover:

• Leggings are not pants. You are influencing an entire generation of plus size shoppers. Have some dignity.
• Clear heels? Really?
• The goth/punk fatties really want their old Torrid back. This doesn’t affect me either way but in the spirit of sisterhood, I ask that you expand the “Edge” line and draw the goth girls back in.
• This is true of any plus size retailer but you need to start letting go of trends when they’re no longer trendy. Or at least stick to a reasonable time frame after the trend is over.
• Ed Hardy is going to be over soon. Do yourself a favor and be the leader in kicking that crap to the curb.

I think that’s about it! I do think Torrid has a great deal of potential to be a really awesome resource for plus size girls and young women. I do realize that it’s intended to be a store for the young people so it’s going to be trendy and a little silly by nature. That doesn’t mean that you should hoist shoddily made, overpriced items on your customers just because you’re a leader in your market. Set a new standard!

Love,
Colleen

I really don’t know if anyone from Torrid or Hot Topics reads this blog but if you want to leave a comment with your thoughts, please do. I’ll link to this post on the LJ thread so those of you without LJ accounts might be heard, too.

Comments

[Glen]

You make a lot of good points. I am sure that if enough people voice their opinion of it they will notice. I posted a link to your article on both Twitter and Facebook.

[SteveD]

U Hold no Punches!
Way to GO!

SteveD

[Christy]

Thank you, that's everything I've been wanting to say to Torrid, wrapped up in a nice, neat blog post.

[Valarie]

I AGREE!!!!

[Vanoue]

Thank you! as my English speaking is very bad these words are exactly what I was thinking about!

[Bree]

I agree about Torrid doing extended sizes. Not every woman who is a size 26 and above is ready for nursing home wear. I also agree with the Live Journal users who would like more mature options. I'm 33 years old---wearing glitter and a shirt that says I Like Boys doesn't make me cute, it makes me a cougar.

[Kindred Smile]

Very well put! Let's hope someone pays attention.

[OTM]

Nicely said, Colleen! I don't think I've ever shopped at Torrid, but if they did half of what you suggest, I would totally try them out.

[Carrie]

Big high five! That was awesome!

[lnz]

I completely disagree about the classic line - I think there are other stores that fill that need and Torrid doesn't seem to be concerned with it, nor should they be. That's just not their role. I also disagree with this: "I’m not expecting Torrid to be in front of trends and be fashion forward." That's EXACTLY what I'm expecting them to do! That is totally why I shop at Torrid - to get the little trendy pieces that other stores aren't carrying. And I'm 27 so I'm certainly not wearing lamé leggings or Twighlight t-shirts.

I definitely agree about the sizing, though. Both the expansion and the standardization.

[Claire]

I too have been so disappointed in the quality of clothes I've gotten from Torrid. And since the prices are so high, I only buy on clearance, but since the sizing is so weird and CLEARANCE ITEMS CANNOT BE RETURNED OR EXCHANGED I now no longer buy from them at all. Colleen, you put it all so well - thank you, and I hope that you're heard.

[The Curvy Fashionista]

Hello there. Lovely post! I have to agree with you on most points, but the one that rings the biggest bell is the quality!
This is the main reason why I do not shop there. I have tried and tried, as I walk in and touch the fabrics and check the seams (I think I have been in retail too long!) I shudder, knowing that with one wear or wash, it is a done deal! Hmmm... call me a fabric snob, but I do not like to fuss with my clothes once I have them on. And quality does not mean spending an arm and a leg on them either, just using a better eye to spot what will last me the longest!
It is bad enough hunting down items that fit and are fashion forward, if I have to keep rebuying the same items, you have me lost. And to Target` I go..

[Noel]

What a great post and very well stated! You know your stuff, sista sledge!

[Jessica]

This is exactly what I've been thinking since I've stopped shopping at Torrid. I'll drop by from time to time to see if they have anything worth investigating, but I always walk away empty handed once I start checking the construction of the garments. I would love to see more 'edge', more 'sub-culture' represented in the cute way that they occasionally market.

[Sara A.]

I'm 23 and feel like I'm too old to shop at Torrid lately. This makes it really hard for me to shop because I feel like I'm too old for Torrid but too young for Lane Bryant and all the dresses at Avenue come in one cut that just doesn't work for me. I'm beginning to think I should hone my sewing chops.

[Deena]

I agree with almost everything you've said except that I think Torrid SHOULD be fashion forward and ahead of trends. Picking up on a trend after its been done by everyone else is like eating someone elses left overs, and thats not appealing regardless however good that meal was.

[C]

Leggings are SO not pants. I love you for saying that because it needed to be heard in a public forum.

[Tee]

Torrid clothes are cheap and in some cases look like hooker clothing. The letter is so on point. Ladies should go to a local Torrid to see what NOT to wear. Cheap and overpriced.

[Kity Bradshaw]

I remember buying a 1950's style dress from Torrid back when it first opened. They seemed to carry vintage/goth pieces when they first opened and now they have strayed from that.

IMO the clothes are ugly and the quality is very cheap. I refuse to purchase clothing that I can only get 1 wear out of.

H&M has fallen drastically in quality and went up in price as well.

I shop in Macy's Harrold Square now for clothes where quality matches price.

[DeDe]

I haven't bought from Torrid in 5 years. The items I got back then I love because I feel they are classy, yet edgy enough for my style. I'm 31 and I still like to get my edge on but not look like a fool.

About a year ago I wrote Torrid about their crappy bridal line. That mess is atrocious!! I never got a reply, yet I feel you should try to forward this to a few people at their company. They have gotten way out of hand.

I thought I was one of the few who felt like Tee in that the clothes look like hooker gear. And you are right, they get on a trend and that same booty crap is there a year later. Nobody wants it!! Well someone, but still, they can do so much better.

I can say I would be happy to see that company fade off into the abyss and I wish people would stop hyping them like they are remotely like anything they used to be. Get it together or just go away!!

[Chrisanthe]

Thank you for saying exactly what I have been thinking! Will you post the response IF Torrid responds?

[Mockingbird Girl]

You make some absolutely excellent points in your open letter about Torrid... I particularly agree with increasing the sizes *up* (being on the cusp of 26/28 myself), increasing the "Edge" collection and Torrid's tendency to "sell a $15 dress for $60".

I had to laugh at your "concern" over lamé leggings & teens. :-) I just turned 40 (!) last month and am actually wearing a pair of lamé leggings I bought from Torrid *right now* (like, as I type). They're the black ones, with the side zip at the ankle. I am, however, wearing them under a dark denim pencil skirt, with a black silky blouse.... You are absolutely right in that leggings are not pants!

Anyway, I *just* discovered your blog today. I'm ever so psyched! Have a good weekend!

[Jade]

Hey Colleen, you sure did a number on poor Torrid. My question is: Do you like about Torrid?

P.S. "Clear heels? Really?" - Priceless!

[Alison]

I agree with most of your points. I wish Torrid would increase their bra sizes too, the last time I went they didn't have my size. The only place I can find my size 42G is Layne Bryant and they aren't very cute. Cute bras are very nice.

[Bridgette]

Hey Colleen!

I just discovered your blog today and I gotta say "good for you!" Every point you mentioned is exactly what I have been complaining about for the past few years. There was a time when I would walk into Torrid and spend my entire paycheck on all things goth. I happen to be one of those "goth fatties" and THE EDGE ain't cutting it. A generic black skirt with a lip service "corset" does not a goth girl make. I miss/want the old Torrid back. I want my QUALITY black ruffle a-line skirts and cotton rockabilly pinup sundresses.

When I walk into torrid now I am ATTACKED with all things Jersey Knit. Like that is the only thing Torrid stocks.
I simply refuse to buy off the website anymore because their sizing is all across the board. Like I said before, there was a time I would walk into Torrid every 2 weeks and spend a few hundred. I can honestly say I haven't been in a Torrid in over a year. Size + Quality/ Goth= :)me.

P.S. I moved on to shopping at Ross instead and find waaaaay better things at a fraction of the price.

[Rita Knight]

Hi Colleen,
I am a 56 year old crossdresser and I dare say that a lot of Torrid's business comes from people like me. The people I know that buy from Torrid want sexy plus size club wear. I learned their MO very early that the time to buy is the half price clearance sale around holidays.

My biggest gripe with Torrid is their maddeningly inconsistent sizing. Some times I wear their 3, smetimes a 2. You have to take into account stretch, an empire waist and other things in selecting size. Roamans and their sister companies have very consistent sizing in contrast. My seamstress gets a lot of business from me because of this.

One thing none of you have mentioned is Torrid items on Ebay. Their dirty secret, they sell a lot of their remainders to jobbers that in turn sell them on Ebay. If you hunt and choose your moment, you can get unused items even cheaper than at the half price clearance sale.

I really wish they would get their act together and I do not wish they would go away.

[Julie]

I completely agree with just about everything that has been said here. I started shopping at Torrid a few years ago when I was a size 12 and had a hard time shopping at stores like the Gap and such because I was just on the upper limit of their sizes. I loved coming to Torrid to feel like a small!! A few years (and a few pounds) later I'm still shopping there but very occasionally and pretty much only when there is a sale going on or I have a coupon. I'm in college now and my dollars simply have to work harder and Torrid doesn't do that for me. I'm tired of washing clothes once to find that they're frayed (or stretched, or shrunk) and cannot be worn any longer. I'm also a little sick of seeing the stores chock full of styles that simply are not flattering on bigger women (ultra-low rise pants? crop leggings? bubble dresses?). I would love for Torrid to start carrying more essential pieces that would last longer than a season or two; things that I can start to actually build a wardrobe out of. For now, I'm on ebay where I can actually buy that $15 dress for $15 (or less!).

[Tali]

I must say that all you ladies and gentleman have made some amazing points. I was a manager at Lane Bryant for 2 years and the basic work wear pants were something that people always came back for time and time again. I never bought any because I'm one of those strange people that would rather wear a dress than pants. However my "rockabilly sundresses" as stated by Bridgette were always a staple item for me. For the past 5 years or so I've worked in stores where I had to dress "nicer" but I have never been able to do the whole black pants and a button down shirt thing. It's just not me. I'm 25 and still love my retro dresses. I agree that Torrid could do a lot of things differently.. most of my dresses are from Torrid.. but I bought them on E-bay because I didn't have $60 to drop on a new dress. And I like that they have a lot of more trendy items but there are certain trends that skinny people shouldn't even wear let alone a big girl. First off, the whole bubble dress/banded bottom dress thing annoys me. They look horrible.. I don't care who you are, you could be the size of Ashley Olsen, but her in a bubble dress and her booty will look huge. They are not flattering at all. I like that they have leggings but some of them are a little bit over the top for me. I wish they had a better selection of tights as well. I love layering things, dresses with tights and knee-hi's and boots or leg warmers and flats.. I mix them all together and always get compliments, however until I discovered the we love colors website (www.welovecolors.com) I resorted to buying regular size tights and cutting the waist off and attatching them to a garter belt.. it worked but got annoying. I like the fact that Torrid wasn't like all the other plus size stores and they didn't have "staple" items. They had a little bit of everything.. I started shopping there back when they first opened as well and I remember loving the wide leg skater looking pants. That was what I was into at the time, but they had a lot of other things as well. I also love that they carry Betsy Johnson but the Ed Hardy is one thing that I wish would just go. They used to carry a line of jeans by Freestyle Revolution and I was in love with them. I still have a few pairs but unfortunately they do not carry them anymore. I think they were replaced with apple bottoms or derreon or whatever other crap is "in" right now. I don't understand the whole looking like a club slut thing but some of their "club wear" is kind of cute and if I were the type to go out to clubs I might wear some of it. So I guess I agree with everyone that has posted in some way. I agree that Torrid should have some basics but at the same time I don't know that those basics really need to be work wear, because Lane Bryant has that covered. Maybe some basic shirts or the classic LBD or something like that. And one Torrid item that I have never grown tired of is my studded belt.. it's a staple for me. So I guess they still have some of the basics. They just need to not be too hot topic-y in some ways like the cheap plastic expensive jewelry.. I buy all my cheap plastic jewelry at claires because there it really is cheap and i can wear it until i get bored of it and not feel bad when i don't wear it anymore because I didn't spend a fortune on it. But I do miss the good old tripp NYC and Rock steady dresses!!!

[Jadedshopper]

I like the Torrid has trendier jean choices. I am 31, and I like "preppy." Torrid used to have a lot of great stuff for me like cool pencil skirts and cute jackets. Then it all went low quality and expensive. I feel like there isn't a great choice anymore. LB hardly ever does pencil or knee length skirts, and when they do they are a-line or matronly. I need to find a new store or drop 3 sizes. There are always plenty of my style clothes at banana republic. :(